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 Post subject: vick's improved passing
PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 9:07 pm 
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here's my very arrogant, unproven, off the cuff, armchair, out of my ass, untheoretical theory on vick's improved passing.
quite simply:
1) good foot work and balance when passing (see vick's footwork thread
http://falcfans.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=909)
2)finn and roddy starting (both of whom had sure hands, save for one finn drop), both had chemistry with vick, by not dropping the ball the momentum wasn't killed nor was vick's confidence dashed as it quickly can be.

if u have your own arrogant, unproven, off the cuff, armchair out of your ass untheoretical theory regarding his improved passing please feel free to share.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 9:29 pm 
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The headlines for the AJC tommorow "Micheal Vick...A passer"

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 9:29 pm 
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The offensive line and pass blocking. When Miami wasn't blitzing the line gave Vick more then 3 seconds to pass.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 10:11 pm 
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i don't know the ending stats for qb hits, sacks and hurries, but around the 3rd quarter they showed it during the game and it was pretty damn bad. a couple of sacks, a double digit number of hits, more hurries. didn't seem so great, but when he had time to pass he definitely got the job done.
thing is, in other games he's had time to pass and still been quite crappy. and as far as wr's, there was how many drops? i just remember finn's one big one. no big momentum swinging drops that take the wind out of the offensive sails. he looked good in the pocket today, actually somewhat comfortable.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:33 am 
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dirtybirdnw wrote:
The offensive line and pass blocking. When Miami wasn't blitzing the line gave Vick more then 3 seconds to pass.


Yeah I'm going to have to question if you were even watching the game...lol

Miami was getting so much pressure on Vick the entire game it was scary. Our O-line took a step back today, but part of that is the quality of Miami's D-linemen as 3 of the 4 have been to the Pro Bowl.

THE ONLY REASON the passing game improved is that our receivers caught the ball.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2005 3:32 am 
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The Incomparable wrote:
Miami was getting so much pressure on Vick the entire game it was scary. Our O-line took a step back today, but part of that is the quality of Miami's D-linemen as 3 of the 4 have been to the Pro Bowl.


I'm going to rewatch the game tape in the coming days, but I disagree. Sure, the Dolphins got pressure, but who hasn't t his year? Our line played at their normal level of play in terms of pass protection. Vick gets hit a lot, and much of the time that's not the OL's direct fault. Vick holds onto the ball a bit longer than your average NFL QB, and he's an easy target outside the pocket.

The OL has been steady, and I'm starting to get tired of the blame they're getting. There have been 3 things this season that have been consistent on the offensive side of the ball: 1) Warrick Dunn 2) Alge Crumpler 3) the offensive line.

In 2004, the average NFL line gave up a sack every 13.7 pass attempts, and about 2.34 per game.
In 2005, the average NFL line gives up a sack every 13.6 pass attempts and about 2.35 per game.

So the NFL is pretty much blocking at the same consistent level. Well in 2004, the Falcons gave up a sack every 7.9 attempts and 3.13 per game.

This year, the Falcons are giving up a sack every 11.4 attempts and 2.25 per game. So we're approaching that NFL average in both regards. So our sacks are down 28% in per game avearge and we're able to make 44% more passes now before giving up a sack. That's very significant improvement. That is not to say that our line has become good all of a sudden, since we're still 25th in the league in terms of sacks given up per pass attempt. But last year, we were 31st, and in fact the Houston Texans line was better in 2004 ranking 29th in the league in that category.

Just by the way Vick plays, we'll probably never sport a line that is going to rank in the Top 10. That would simply be amazing, and short of Vick becoming a phenomenal pocket passer, and us sporting 1 or 2 Pro Bowlers up front, it's probably not going to happen.

Interestingly enough, these are the 10 best protected QBs in the league, based on their OL stats (sacks allowed per attempt):

1. Peyton Manning, Colts, 2.45% sacks allowed
2. Brett Favre, Packers, 3.36%
3. Tom Brady, Patriots, 3.95%
4. Jake Plummer, Broncos, 4.12%
5. Gus Frerotte, Dolphins, 4.46%
6. Eli Manning, Giants, 4.65%
7. Drew Brees, Chargers, 4.78%
8. Donovan McNabb, Eagles, 5.04%
9. Carson Palmer, Bengals, 5.12%
10. Jake Delhomme, Panthers, 5.31%

Here are the 10 worst:

1. David Carr, Texans, 22.4% sacks allowed
2. Culpepper/Johnson, Vikings, 13.48%
3. Smith/Dorsey/Pickett, 49ers, 13.23%
4. Testaverde/Bollinger, Jets, 11.76%
5. Aaron Brooks, Saints, 9.62%
6. Simms/Griese, Bucs, 9.23%
7. Michael Vick, Falcons, 8.74%
8. Drew Blesdoe, Cowboys, 8.57%
9. Byron Leftwich, Jaguars, 8.55%
10. Marc Bulger, Rams, 8.16%

I think we're well on our way to being out of the "Bottom Top Worst Lines". A few more solid draft picks/free agent signings, and we could be there by next year.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2005 2:47 pm 
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IMO the line gave Vick tons of time to pass in this game. The only time they didn't is when Miami brought 7 or 8 on a house blitz and it's pretty rare you can get enough blockers to stop that.

I give kudos to the offensive line in this game.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2005 3:25 pm 
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The line didn't do that bad...most of the hits Vick was taking was either a mess he got himself into, or a late hit.....

Vick impressed me today...he was a little more willing to sit in the pocket and throw the ball...he was on target with all of his passes except for 1 or 2...the wr's came down with the ball consistantly for the first time in a while to...

my only problem was the coaches insistance on running the ball inside...the Dolphins didn't let us have that from the first snap and Mora and Co. didn't seem to catch on...Dunn is a powerful runner, especially for his size, but they should have know better than to think we were getting anything inside on them...


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2005 4:02 pm 
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Pudge wrote:
The Incomparable wrote:
Miami was getting so much pressure on Vick the entire game it was scary. Our O-line took a step back today, but part of that is the quality of Miami's D-linemen as 3 of the 4 have been to the Pro Bowl.


In 2004, the average NFL line gave up a sack every 13.7 pass attempts, and about 2.34 per game.
In 2005, the average NFL line gives up a sack every 13.6 pass attempts and about 2.35 per game.

So the NFL is pretty much blocking at the same consistent level. Well in 2004, the Falcons gave up a sack every 7.9 attempts and 3.13 per game.

This year, the Falcons are giving up a sack every 11.4 attempts and 2.25 per game. So we're approaching that NFL average in both regards. So our sacks are down 28% in per game avearge and we're able to make 44% more passes now before giving up a sack. That's very significant improvement. That is not to say that our line has become good all of a sudden, since we're still 25th in the league in terms of sacks given up per pass attempt. But last year, we were 31st, and in fact the Houston Texans line was better in 2004 ranking 29th in the league in that category.

Just by the way Vick plays, we'll probably never sport a line that is going to rank in the Top 10. That would simply be amazing, and short of Vick becoming a phenomenal pocket passer, and us sporting 1 or 2 Pro Bowlers up front, it's probably not going to happen.

Interestingly enough, these are the 10 best protected QBs in the league, based on their OL stats (sacks allowed per attempt):

1. Peyton Manning, Colts, 2.45% sacks allowed
2. Brett Favre, Packers, 3.36%
3. Tom Brady, Patriots, 3.95%
4. Jake Plummer, Broncos, 4.12%
5. Gus Frerotte, Dolphins, 4.46%
6. Eli Manning, Giants, 4.65%
7. Drew Brees, Chargers, 4.78%
8. Donovan McNabb, Eagles, 5.04%
9. Carson Palmer, Bengals, 5.12%
10. Jake Delhomme, Panthers, 5.31%

Here are the 10 worst:

1. David Carr, Texans, 22.4% sacks allowed
2. Culpepper/Johnson, Vikings, 13.48%
3. Smith/Dorsey/Pickett, 49ers, 13.23%
4. Testaverde/Bollinger, Jets, 11.76%
5. Aaron Brooks, Saints, 9.62%
6. Simms/Griese, Bucs, 9.23%
7. Michael Vick, Falcons, 8.74%
8. Drew Blesdoe, Cowboys, 8.57%
9. Byron Leftwich, Jaguars, 8.55%
10. Marc Bulger, Rams, 8.16%

I think we're well on our way to being out of the "Bottom Top Worst Lines". A few more solid draft picks/free agent signings, and we could be there by next year.


The Packers gave up a sack on Sunday so the numbers may change. The Packers RT Tauscher had the second holding penalty of his 6 year starting career. O-line for the Packers is not very good this year. Which is the main part of their struggles.

At NFL.com they have Vick at 26th in QB rating, 29th in TD's, 30th in passing yardage.


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