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 Post subject: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Sun Apr 28, 2013 10:58 am 
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there was much 'talk' about Nolan being looked at as a HC elsewhere in the league, but he announced he would be coming back....I mentioned to Pudge that had TD jumped up to get a TE early, he would lose Nolan. I know I sure wouldn't stay, or at least I would be entertaining offers..

I believe that the conversation went something along the lines of: " stay, and we will give you the farm in the draft'.

the draft comes and we go :

Round 1 (22) - CB Desmond Trufant, Washington
Round 2 (60) - CB Robert Alford, SE Louisiana
Round 4 (127) - DE Malliciah Goodman, Clemson
Round 4 (133) - TE Levine Toilolo, Stanford
Round 5 (163) - DE Stansly Maponga, TCU
Round 7 (243) - S Kemal Ishmael, Central Florida
Round 7 (244) - S Zeke Motta, Notre Dame
Round 7 (249) - QB Sean Renfree, Duke



Nolan comes in and see's two non 'team players'. Edwards and Grimes...they are outta here and we pick 2 CB's early and 2 DE's later . I love the Nolan Show!

only 2 offense picks!?QB is basically a long term backup, that maybe could be trained up to trade for picks down the road, ala Schaub. The TE is an athletic marvel with big-time potential, and one that comes from a Stanford program known for producing NFL-quality tight ends. Excellent pick at the end of the fourth round, in my opinion. I know people are saying 'he's big, but lacks technique and was buried behind Ertz.' I dont think we drafted him with the idea that withing one year he would come in and start to take over for TG, just due to his size. Maybe in the redzone, but his routes aren't all that great, and he needs polishing. But, provided he can remain healthy, he can be taught up to be a decent blocking TE, something Coffman or TG dont do consistantly well at. Then either one of our current TE's step up this year, or we go all out next season for the best TE on the board. Then, were 'set' and we can go about restructuring our offense to incorporate more 2 TE schemes, at a time when SJax and Snelling may be slowing down. Makes sense to me.

I dont know much about the safeties, but I think it is wortth noting that Nolan is putting his imprint not only on MIke Smith's D, but TD's draft.

All hail Nolan! :dance:


and from the Falcoholic:

Ronnie Wingo, Jr., RB/FB - Arkansas

4.4ish 40 yard dash. Played in the SEC. Big boy. That's about it.

Terren Jones, OT - Alabama State

Immediately the biggest player on the team - he's almost 6'8 and he's pushing 360 lbs. Good Vishnu, we could just have him sit on opposing players. I'm most impressed by his vertical, which was 24 inches at his pro day.

Ryan Schraeder, OT - Valdosta State

The best division 2 offensive linemen in the country last year, he's roster filler, the good kind.

Seth Doege, QB - Texas Tech

Last name pronounced DAY-ghee, his 333.7 passing yards/game was 5th best in the country last year. That said, he's probably destined for the practice squad at best.

Matt Smith, C - Kentucky

Put up 28 reps at 225 lbs at his pro day. He's a smart center who played defensive tackle until college. Has struggled with durability issues, pulling a hammy at his pro day.

Casey Barth, K - North Carolina

Kid seems to have a leg on him. And he apparently withstood straight rejection at his pro day. But let's be honest, he's just here to keep Matt Bryant company during training camp. Ya know, because Bryant gets lonely sometimes.

Joplo Bartu, LB - Texas State

Notched 62 tackles in the last 4 games of his collegiate career, he's gotta be better than Robert James. He will need to adjust to playing against far better talent, because let's be honest, the Western Athletic Conference isn't exactly known for churning out pros.

Nick Clancy, LB - Boston College

He went to the same school as Matt Ryan, and that's gotta count for something!

Rashad Evans, WR - Fresno State

Tiny, speedy receiver with returner potential.

Donald Russell, RB - Georgia State

Occasionally dominated mediocre talent in college. Local kid who impressed several NFL scouts at his pro day.

Sean Sellwood, P - Utah

Not Matt Bosher, but then again, only Matt Bosher is Matt Bosher. Makes sense, right?

Brandon Thurmond, OLB - Arkansas Pine-Bluff

Built like a dump truck, notching 25 tackles for a loss in 2012. Some draft scouts had him going in the 6th or 7th round.

Paul Worrilow, ILB - Delaware

Leader of the Blue Hen defense in 2012, he was good enough to not play at Delaware. We're thin at LB, so any depth helps.
8-)

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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 3:59 am 
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I think it was just talk..... Nolan was a horrible head Coach with Frisco, so bad that it may take 10 years for some to forget.....

He's excellent as a defensive Coach!! Some defensive Coaches just get hung up on the QB then their personalities; then they go public. I think he's got a good job where he could maybe stay awhile. I'd almost prefer that than moving every year......

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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 9:29 am 
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There's something to be said about settling into a position that he can be comfortable knowing he's with a great organization. Also, he can build a defense his way knowing that TD and Smitty will support him (as long as he's effective). And he can be effective because he's an innovative DC that, with some good talent, can form a special defense.

I am disappointed we could do more to help the OL and DL especially. We struggled to run the ball and stop the run, and we couldn't get to the QB either. Not a great foundation for a potential super bowl contender. Perhaps Abe will be back (which I see as a realistic possibility) which will help a ton. I'm excited about Goodman because he seems like a guy who could be a solid 1st and 2nd down LE for us. He's not necessarily going to get to the QB a lot, but he's got the size and length to stand up the blockers and make plays on RBs. He can also be solid 3-4 DE when we move into those formations. Our secondary ought to be a lot better. Trufant and Alford will be the future on the outside, and I like some of the late picks as depth and special formation players. For example, Motta looks to me to be a good option for a 5th DB that can help stop the run and cover TEs.

On offense, I'm concerned about the OL being so young. Toilolo could be special in the redzone, but that's about it. I'd just hate to see a potentially great offense derailed by an OL that struggles.

Back to Nolan, if he's smart, he will understand himself enough to know that he can make a name and a lot of money for himself with this franchise. He struggled as a HC, but he can be special here. I hope he figures that out.


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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 11:50 am 
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Nolan will move on to another head coaching role at some point. It might be next year or the year after but he will move on. I imagine the only reason he still in Atlanta is that none of the jobs available last year looked intriguing to him.

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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 4:06 pm 
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Nolan and Wade Phillips are of the same grain. They build great defenses, but can't manage an entire team. Buddy Ryan was the same way. Some people are best suited to certain roles, and that's just life. If they realize that they are good in certain roles, and not good in others, then they might be comfortable doing what they do best. They might not be happy doing that, they might want to continue to try to make it at the next level, and there's nothing wrong with that. But I think that there's some leverage in saying, "Look, I'm the best DC out there, I'll keep being the best DC out there if you pay me the big bucks. If not, I'm going to try my hand at HC somewhere."


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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 4:15 pm 
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RobertAP wrote:
Nolan and Wade Phillips are of the same grain. They build great defenses, but can't manage an entire team. Buddy Ryan was the same way. Some people are best suited to certain roles, and that's just life. If they realize that they are good in certain roles, and not good in others, then they might be comfortable doing what they do best. They might not be happy doing that, they might want to continue to try to make it at the next level, and there's nothing wrong with that. But I think that there's some leverage in saying, "Look, I'm the best DC out there, I'll keep being the best DC out there if you pay me the big bucks. If not, I'm going to try my hand at HC somewhere."



true enough, but I feel that both Nolan and Wade would jump at a HC position again. It is in thier blood. Now, give them some credit for being 'selective'. I dont think Nolan or Phillips are content managing one side of the ball, even if they are damn good at it. They still want the brass ring.

Arthur's lasagna has a shelf life. Without a doubt Nolan will leave us to take a HC gig. It's not happening this year, maybe not next year, but it is a forgone conclusion, IMO. :ninja:

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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 8:54 pm 
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The skill set of a HC and a coord are very different. You can look at lots of failed HC that go back to being excellent coordinators. As Dirty Harry said, "A man's got to know his limitations."

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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 9:30 pm 
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Wease wrote:
The skill set of a HC and a coord are very different. You can look at lots of failed HC that go back to being excellent coordinators. As Dirty Harry said, "A man's got to know his limitations."



yeah, that is all fine and good, but Hollywood and the NFL reality are much, much different...

At this point, in terms of coaching, it is still a 'meritrocacy', or 'what have you done for me lately'.

I imagine guys who have spent thier entire lives, from college to NFL , through the ranks working, they always WANT to be the head coach. It is part of the brand, and the 'call'. Now, sure you can say things like 'some guys are just happy being the bass player in the band, and making a good check and being a team player'. But the bass player with the chops that can actually DO the job: those guys are different. They WANT to front the band. Too many to list here.

Basically a guy who has worked his way up and has been a HC, always want to go back. Thyeree may be a few 'outliers', but they are the execption: not the rule. Right, Pudge? :wink: You think Petrino wouldn't jump at a chance to be a HC in the NFL? In a second. But he F8cked up so bad, all he can hope for now is college.

You guys can believe all you want that Nolan has no eyes on a bigger prize, but you would be fooling yourself. :ninja:

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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 3:52 am 
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If Nolan really wanted to be a head coach he could go to college anytime. He's already been head coach at LSU, RICE, & STANFORD.

Nolan's record as a head coach at Frisco was 18- 37........Fired in mid year. He made more noise than Singletary. With your only resume as a head Coach in the NFL being
18-37 I don't think he'll be offered a job worth taking.....

Man he lobbied to be able to wear a suite on the sidelines more than anything.....

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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:01 am 
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Cyril wrote:
If Nolan really wanted to be a head coach he could go to college anytime. He's already been head coach at LSU, RICE, & STANFORD.

Nolan's record as a head coach at Frisco was 18- 37........Fired in mid year. He made more noise than Singletary. With your only resume as a head Coach in the NFL being
18-37 I don't think he'll be offered a job worth taking.....

Man he lobbied to be able to wear a suite on the sidelines more than anything.....

your right, he could go college at anytime. But, that is a step down. Not even a lateral move: he could just as well go be a DC for a few other franchises in the NFL.

But, don't kid yourself, Nolan and Phillips both desire to be HC in the NFL again. It's what they strived thier entire careers for. Just because the last time out they screwed up, doesn't change that fact. At some point, Nolan will leave the Falcons, and it wont be following in BVG's footprints.

Count on it. 8-)

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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 10:25 am 
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It's all about money and pride. No matter how many times someone fails at being a head coach they will always accept another offer to become a head coach. There is no other opportunity in the football coaching world that pays more than a head coaches position in the NFL. Then there is the pride issue of proving everyone wrong and that they really can run an NFL franchise.

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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:45 pm 
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Ok I'll agree most everyone wants to be a head coach....

However with a 18-37 record on your only chance he won't be taking over any good head coaching job, unless Arthur someday hired him..... Then he'd show why he was
18-37 again.

I will take the other side of the argument though---- He was also the Gm and was worse than Reeves and that's a rather bad Gm. I just don't think most owners would want him;
and he's not getting any younger.

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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 4:04 pm 
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Here's the breakdown:

1. Every coach wants to be a head coach.
2. Every former NFL head coach wants to get a 2nd chance (or 3rd, 4th, etc. chance), but most coaches believe that their initial failures aren't due to their lack of coaching ability (and if it is, then they have subsequently learned a lot from that experience), but due to the conditions/environment. Maybe they had a questionable owner, or questionable GM/personnel department.
3. Most coaches see the NFL as the pinnacle, and thus are unwilling to accept college head coaching gigs because they feel its a step down. Similar to players, the have a competitive drive that wants to test itself at the highest level.

I also think that while a third of coaching hires over the past 10-12 years have been "retreads" i.e. coaches with previous NFL head coaching experience, I do think the tendency nowadays is that the only guys that get those 2nd/3rd/etc. opportunities are those that had a high level of success. There are exceptions, but they tend to be organizations that are "small markets."

Some organization have ownership that largely believe in hiring coaches with previous head coaching experience (e.g. Buffalo, Kansas City, San Diego, Seattle) whether that is from a previous stint in the NFL or at the collegiate level. Others typically target fresh new faces.

But I think by and large Nolan is not a threat to leave for another team as a head coach. His lack of success in San Francisco is unlikely to move many folks. He's only likely to get an opportunity for a smaller market team that has an owner like Ralph Wilson that wants to keep costs down, but also get someone with experience.

I think Nolan is far more likely to move on from Atlanta to accept a defensive coordinator position with another team rather than because someone hires him as a head coach.

The reality is that Nolan has never coordinated a team longer than 4 years. 4 years under Reeves with the Giants, then 3 years with the Redskins under Norv Turner, then a year under Al Groh with the Jets, followed by 3 years in Baltimore under Billick, a year under Josh McDaniels in Denver, and then 2 years under Sparano in Miami.

I just don't see a team giving Nolan another chance. Never say never, but it's long odds. After all, Nolan might just as infamous long-term for choosing Alex Smith over Aaron Rodgers due to "personality issues." I can't see a team handing him the reins of their franchise, especially if he'll be expected to groom a young quarterback, which is more often the case when teams are hiring new head coaches.

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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 4:26 pm 
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Pudge wrote:
I just don't see a team giving Nolan another chance. Never say never, but it's long odds. After all, Nolan might just as infamous long-term for choosing Alex Smith over Aaron Rodgers due to "personality issues." I can't see a team handing him the reins of their franchise, especially if he'll be expected to groom a young quarterback, which is more often the case when teams are hiring new head coaches.



I respectfully disgaree, and guys like Wade Phillips bear this out. How many 'chances' has he had? 4?

I understand the difference between Nolan and Wade, but Nolan keeps this depleted D in 'the mix', and he will be considered. He was last season, he got 'calls'.....in his 'first season'? :shock:

http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/ ... s-interest

So, your saying if he strings together 2 more successfull season of making chickensalad our of chickensh*t, that kind of 'interest' is not going to be there? I dont see it.

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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 5:40 pm 
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Comparing Nolan and Wade makes little sense. Prior to getting his job in Dallas, Wade had a 45-33 record as a head coach (not coutning his 2 brief stints as an interim coach) and had led his team to the playoffs in 3 out of the 5 seasons he had coached. Never to a win, but it was conceivable when Jerry Jones hired him that he could be a winning coach because his worst season was a 7-9 year in Denver. The best Nolan has ever done was 7-9.

Sure, Nolan got calls. And maybe, just maybe he gets an interview with a team and blows the GM/ownership away. But like I said, it's very long odds. How difficult will it be for an owner to sell to his fan base a career win percentage that is equivalent of a 5-11 team with no playoff experience as a head coach. And while most think Wade might not get another gig, remember he won 60% of his games in Dallas, and went to the playoffs 2 out of 4 years he was there. Wade isn't a hard sell. Arguably one of the Top 3 DCs in the league and has led his team to the playoffs 5 out of 8 full seasons as a head coach. Now, Wade's inabiity to win in January I think will ultimately be the stumbling block for him in most NFL cities.

Mularkey got a second gig because there were a coalition of factors, first of which is that his previous stint as a head coach seemed unfinished: 2 yrs in Buffalo, with his 2nd losing season being mainly due to going to with a young JP Losman and dumping Drew Bledsoe (they were 9-7 with Bledsoe in Yr 1), secondly, his successful "rearing" of Matt Ryan in Atlanta had re-earned him points for grooming young QBs, which earns you a ton of points in ownership boxes, and third of which he was hired by a small market team with a brand new owner that had been taken under the wing of Arthur Blank, and thought maybe by hiring Mularkey some of that Falcons "resurrection" magic would rub off in his organization. Why do you think David Caldwell got hired in Jacksonville? Shad Khan wants to be "Florida Falcons."

What are the strengths of Nolan that would attract an owner? He's a great defensive coordinator? Okay that's a feather in the hat, but barring him putting together a Falcons defense that is perennial one of the top-ranked units in the league. Look at Dom Capers, are any teams jumping over themselves to hire him? The reason is that his combined coaching record is 48-80 as a head coach. Steve Spagnuolo is considered a top-flight DC, but he was a terrible head coach.

And don't think just because Nolan got interviews means he's a strong candidate for a job. If/when Nolan gets a 2nd interview with a team, then maybe. But didn't his interviews come with teams like Philly and Chicago that interviewed like 15 coaches.

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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 5:47 pm 
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Pudge wrote:
Comparing Nolan and Wade makes little sense.



And don't think just because Nolan got interviews means he's a strong candidate for a job. If/when Nolan gets a 2nd interview with a team, then maybe. But didn't his interviews come with teams like Philly and Chicago that interviewed like 15 coaches.



point one, see: "I understand the difference between Nolan and Wade, but Nolan keeps this depleted D in 'the mix', and he will be considered. He was last season, he got 'calls'.....in his 'first season'".

So you think if we make the playoffs for the next two years, his 'offers' are going to go 'down'? I don't.

Im just sayin', the man had 'interest; after hs first year. String together 2 more strong seasons, and there will be much more 'interest'. You appear to think his history will prevent him from being truly 'considered' and he will just get interviews. I disagree. :ninja:

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 Post subject: Re: Draft 2013: The Nolan Show
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 8:42 pm 
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Again, I want to separate the difference between getting calls and getting offers. He'll continue to get plenty of calls because he's one of the best defensive coordinators in the business. But will he get any offers? I don't think so. Again, I can't say it'll never happen, but I'm just saying it's highly doubtful. I just don't think in this day and age a coach that averaged 4.5 wins per year is going to get many teams to really consider offering him the job.

You look over recent years, the majority of the retreads were coaches that were highly successful with previous gigs: e.g. Jeff Fisher, Andy Reid, Mike Shanahan, Pete Carroll. The few that weren't like, say Romeo Crennel was hired by a team after serving as an interim coach, and the GM who hired him knew him for 20 years. Chan Gailey got hired in Buffalo, but people forget that Gailey had a winning record in Dallas & Georgia Tech.

I think you're vastly overestimating how much his interview meant. He's on people's radar, but he was on the Eagles radar along with over a dozen other candidates. The Eagles pretty much interviewed a coordinator on every playoff team last year. Keith Armstrong got like 3 interviews last year. So does that mean that Keith Armstrong is on the cusp of getting a head coaching gig, and 3 times as likely?

IMHO, the chances that Nolan gets another gig are about on par with folks like Scott Linehan, Jim Zorn, Bill Callahan, Steve Spagnuolo, or Gregg Williams. Because IMO, his legacy as a head coach is even lesser than people like Brad Childress, Raheem Morris, or Herm Edwards.

And to erase that legacy he's going to have to do a lot more with the Falcons moving forward (or any team for that matter). Because he's there cold harsh truth:

2011 Falcons Defensive Rankings

Scoring Defense: 12th
Total Defense: 18th
Takeaways: 10th
Rush Defense (Yds): 6th
Rush Defense (YPC): 15th
Pass Defense (Yds): 20th
Pass Defense (Net YPA): 19th

2012 Falcons Defensive Rankings

Scoring Defense: 5th
Total Defense: 24th
Takeaways: 5th
Rush Defense (Yds): 21st
Rush Defense (YPC): 29th
Pass Defense (Yds): 23rd
Pass Defense (Net YPA): 22nd

Compare that to say Gus Bradley, who was the lone DC hired this past year, and his 2012 Seahawk defense:

Scoring Defense: 1st
Total Defense: 4th
Takeaways: 5th
Rush Defense (Yds): 10th
Rush Defense (YPC): 23rd
Pass Defense (Yds): 6th
Pass Defense (Net YPA): 5th

Again, if you're an NFL owner, why would you ever choose Nolan? If you want a good defensive mind, then go out and hire somebody that didn't prove he was a poor NFL head coach.

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